Curse

Sergeant of Marines · Sep 10, 2007, 11:34 PM // 23:34

The thing I see the most for GWEN is people either Love it or Hate it, there is really no in between for most people. I enjoy it at times and dont at others, but this same drawn out argument has been started and repeated since Factions came out.

You can not make the entire Population Happy with everything you/they do. The OP was right on with most the things he said. Also reading more into it, I find that the majority of people I play with are in the same situation.

Scale of 1 to 10 for GWEN.

I give it a 6.

Keifru · Sep 11, 2007, 12:11 AM // 00:11

I salute you for taking your time to flesh out your questions and observations in such an organized manner.

Now if we all would do such things...

hallomik · Sep 11, 2007, 12:28 AM // 00:28

Here's the condensed version for readers without unlimited time.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sha Noran

Dear A-Net,

1. Why don't Destroyer have healers?

2. Endgame Droknar's Key collectors are unattactive.

2.5 The dungeons are not as hard as The Deep, Urgoz, DoA, Underworld.

3. Why aren't the dungeon bosses harder?

4. Why is there unlimited rez in a dungeon?

5. Why is there only one elite dungeon and why is it still doable?

6. Why are Destroyer weapons so easy to acquire?

7. Why are all the GW:EN armor sets largely re-skins?

8. Why is Hard Mode not yet in the game?

If you don't answer my questions...

People are not going to buy Guild Wars 2 otherwise.

Sincerely,
Sha Noran

I think I speak for most players when I say the difficulty is about right. They always said the dungeons would have a Sorrow's Furnace level of difficulty and I would say that's correct - not a "lie" - and a good thing for most. Hard mode will surely come along for the players like you and will have, I'm sure, better rewards to go with the tougher challenges.

I think the only thing new in the post was the unlimited rez's in the dungeons. I'm personally in favor, but I can see the argument against it. Again, wait for Hard Mode.

fenix · Sep 11, 2007, 12:29 AM // 00:29

A lot of people are posting that "11 hours in a row, you are part of the 10% that are hardcore" or similar. The thing is, sure Sha did it in 11 hours in a row...but I did it in 11 hours (with ONLY heroes/hench) spread out over several days. It's the same thing, the game only takes that amount of time, regardless of whether you play it all at once, or over a week or two.

I agree with the majority that have posted here. Let's see what Anet have to say. They can't just ignore this, considering that a LOT of people have the same opinion.

makosi · Sep 11, 2007, 12:44 AM // 00:44

I agree with what has been posted in the OP, almost entirely.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lyra Song

But often, the secrets to a lot of magic tricks are very very simple. And not at all magical. Once you know the secret, the magic goes away a bit.

Its the same with Guild Wars. Those of us here know the tricks already. We've played the games, we've studied it, wikied it, made builds and beaten the challenges they've thrown our way.

QFT. This is the crux of the problem. Guild Wars has reached saturation in the product life cycle and has been there for a very long time. Factions and Nightfall did not re-invent Guild Wars but injected a new lease of life in to it just like Eye of the North is doing right now.

Remember the days when you'd go to The Underworld and get party-wiped by the first mob? Or when you could go in to a totally Random PuG with a random skill bar to Tombs and win? Or when it took a fortnight to get from Ascalon to Hell's Precipice? When Ascension meant something of an achievement? When gold drops were so incredibley rare and extremely crap?

That was the best time in Guild Wars for most people because they didn't know what to do, where to go and every little part of the massive world was exciting and fulfilling.

Player attitudes have changed so that they rush through the game to get the end-game green or farm rare skins to make big money and exploit the lesser informed. Prophecies was and is an extremely high-quality product and subsequent releases must exceed Prophecies in all aspects if players are to be content. EotN is a mere expansion and not an equivelant product in terms of size and scale to the prior releases which instantly makes it and inferior product. Its easy for us to expect a lot since Factions and Nightfall were enormous additions with brand new weapon and armour skins which we took for granted. I'm no expert but I have reason to believe that modelling these weapons requires a lot of time, effort and resources. They then have to be tested for clipping, bugs and adjusted accordingly.

In response to the OP:

1) I agree that Destroyers aren't that great. They are simple brute force and a lot of ignorance and ANet obviously tried to force us in to not using Searing Flames eles everywhere. It's a great idea to try to alter the PvE meta builds but the typical SS necro > Destroyers. Monks and Rits would make mesmers more than welcome in a pug which is what people have been requesting for a long time.

2) Again, I agree than the end game greens were bad. Simple 'old' skins with a frosted coating. RIP Dwarven Axes.

3) Dungeon bosses with overpowered skills would be fine if they didn't have halved hex/condition durations and double casting speed. Again, weakening the PvE mesmer. When it came ot Duncan The Black I sent Livia in alone with Spoil Victor and had Tahlkora use Prot Spirit on her. Absolutely no skill or initiative required, just embracing Build Wars. [many thanks to guildwiki!]

4) Hard Mode will have a 'no resurrection at 60% DP' rule. Sometimes when you're wiped out by a boss though, there's a shrine right next to it so you res and the boss doesn't have to regen. It's then near impossible to fail. I'll be honest, I like that.

5) I think the reason that it's elite is because it has Necro/Assassins everywhere with infinite energy and spam touches all the time. They also programmed the AI so that you couldn't pull mobs and luring one would draw all groups. Duncan has Duncan's Defense which means that only a few skills can kill him. Build Wars.

6) I think ANet finally learned that having extremely overpriced weaponry/armour doesn not just sink the gold but it also insights purchasing gold. The wammos have to had to have a Tormented shield and sword so they'd buy the gold and have it the easy way. Destroyer weapons aren't so extreme and people won't feel the need/want to buy gold to pay for it because completing dungeons gives the Diamonds/Onyx Gemstones and gold required. Just a theory.

Meh, it can't be that bad since so many people still play.

My EotN score would be 9/10.

Value: 9
Gameplay:9
Sound Graphics:9

Chris Blackstar · Sep 11, 2007, 12:51 AM // 00:51

My only disappointment was the fact that Anet mentioned that while playing in a dungon, one it would be like a maze with hidden treasures and secrets, and two if you guide died, your party was on your own, those two things never materalized in GW:EN.

bamm bamm bamm · Sep 11, 2007, 01:24 AM // 01:24

GW will always be both extremely easy and extremely hard for separate demographics. It has no challenge for the people who want it and no crutch for the people who need it. It's massively polarized in that it punishes the casual player and provides no challenge for the hardcore player. What you really want is a high/uncapped leveling system, you just don't realize it yet. Of course no-one thinks they do because when they think of leveling they think of grinding, as leveling has always been a tool for the pay-to-play business model. It serves other roles too, though. Mostly as a time-consuming crutch for the unskilled, and conversely, a continuing challenge for the skilled. As Malice Black said, GW is not a good choice for the hardcore PvE player.

That's not to dismiss some of your other points though, such as supposedly high-level endgame payoffs, which I consider to be valid criticisms.

trobinson97 · Sep 11, 2007, 01:24 AM // 01:24

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chthon

[EDIT: Perhaps I misjudged the OP. Given this later post

it seems I have. Consider the following a commentary on many similar posts plaguing these forums, but not OP's post in particular.]

By and large, this post did not impress me. Most of it struck me as backhanded e-peen stroking - complaining about how easy the game is while simultaneously pointing out how incredibly great the author is. Most of the rest is the same elitist garbage we've seen in other threads, just with better spelling and grammar. Ultimately though, it boils down to: "OMG now everyone can play the hardest stage and get the coolest weapons, so I can't feel superior to them anymore, and... dammit... I want to feel superior. I want to be the best! <lisa simpson>grade me! grade me!</lisa simpson>" And, ultimately, that argument is not convincing to me no matter how you dress it up.

IMO, this was the first time a-net got things right with the difficulty level and item rarity. Finally a GW game where all the content is accessible to Joe Average. We haven't seen that with "elite" areas since prophecies. And we've never had that with items. Now I can play whatever zone I want to play, and attain whatever items I want to attain; and Joe can play whatever zones he wants to play, and attain whatever items he wants; and you can play whatever zone you want, and attain whatever items you want -- and everyone can be happy. Well,... except you, because you want to feel superior to me and Joe; you want some proof of your superiority built into the structure of the game. The problem with that is that, to satisfy your desire to feel superior, it is unavoidably necessary that Joe and I go unsatisfied in some way. That is a selfish and childish sentiment that a-net never should have indulged. And I am glad that they have finally stopped doing so.

Do not tell me this is about the game being too easy. That's not it. There are plenty of ways that you can make the game more difficult for yourself without affecting the rest of us: Play with a team of 7, or 6, or less. Restrict your party composition to something less than optimal. Play with a PUG. (Now there's a challenge!) I could go on. The point is: until you're doing slaver's exile solo with an assassin, you don't need to be whining for a-net to increase the difficulty; you can increase it perfectly well on your own. You're whining for a difficulty increase because you want to see it get increased on other people to the point that they fail and you can feel superior again. And that's not something I can support.

Despite my total disagreement with the main sentiment of the OP, in the following, OP is correct:

Now there's a great post, and explains the attitude of a lot of guru members/veteran guild wars players. My only regret is that I don't have more to add, Chthon has said it all.

Lianna · Sep 11, 2007, 01:31 AM // 01:31

This sums up my concerns, well done.

IlikeGW · Sep 11, 2007, 02:05 AM // 02:05

Sounds like you want the whole thing to be more DoA, kick your ass for breakfast, lunch, and dinner until someone makes easy builds. I don't really see the point. And I actually like the ressing in dungeons, it's bad enough the rewards aren't much... it would be absolute crap to have to grind them over and over if you just want it completed or something.

o m g pizowned · Sep 11, 2007, 02:28 AM // 02:28

DoA took time to make builds, it was a challenge and it still is for people who haven't been doing it for months.
I have also been playing Guild Wars for 2 years. I was dissapointed with nightfall but it wasn't terrible. GW:EN on the other hand is almost unbearable (for me.) I played it for probably 10 hours and was extremely bored. Dungeons are easy, PvE is easy, quests are stretched out. Having dungeons easy isn't a bad thing, but having them challenging is better. It gives people a reason to keep playing them, to master what they can't. I wouldn't mind not playing GW:EN but almost all other aspects of the game are gone as well. Sha pointed out a lot of sensible points and I really hope that ANet reads this carefully and many times through.

Esan · Sep 11, 2007, 02:28 AM // 02:28

I believe Gaile Gray has said that Hard Mode is in development and will be added soon. I hope soon means in a month at most. Being a dynamically updated game, it doesn't need to be completely polished and bug-free at release (which is impossible anyway), and much of the Hard Mode code should already be ready. There aren't even any extra elites or skills to assign as most mobs have decent bars already.

I think Hard Mode should make the following changes:

Remove all res shrines in dungeons. Instead, grant the blessing when you enter the dungeon.
Dump the NPC "guides", or keep them dead once they die. The essential ones (=Budger Blackpowder) are already immune to all damage.
Debug the monster skills. Diamondshard Mist should not be divertible. Lava Wave should not leave the giant lava turkey vulnerable to life stealing.

The one problem is that the design of hard mode makes it difficult (ntm annoying) to make it to certain dungeons like Kathandrax without a little bit of DP already. This can be avoided if you wipe all DP at the start of a dungeon.

By the way, out of sheer curiosity, I would love to see some figures about the popularity of Hard Mode. What percentage of instanced zones are in Hard Mode? It is easy to find this (I am 95% sure Anet mines this statistic already) and releasing it would surely not undermine the game in any way.

I don't agree with the OP about enforced grind for such things as destroyer weapons, nor about the obsession with armors. Most of my chars still wear their droknar armor they got two years back, and the /bonus weapons satisfy all my needs already.

TheHaxor · Sep 11, 2007, 02:31 AM // 02:31

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sha Noran

1. Why don't Destroyer type creatures even have Monks? Rits? Anything that heals them?
Yeah, they hit for a lot. Yeah, you can't really block anything they do. Yeah, they're immune to Burning. Who cares? 2 Necro heroes and 2 Mesmer heroes running hexes, and you don't even take damage. They just die. You can survive an unlimited amount of them, and it's not even a challenge because they have no Condition removal, and their only Hex removal is Hex Eater Vortex and Shatter Hex. I'm supposed to believe that the ultimate hardcore badass foe in the whole world of Tyria, the ones that are going to consume EVERYTHING, don't even have heals? Not even Heal Sig?

Why would ANet make the campaign difficult to complete by making high levels that much harder to kill? The campaign portions of the game aren't supposed to make you tear your hair out. People who just want to get through the game with whatever build they want to run should be allowed to do so. People would hate the game if it was very difficult to complete, because the same builds would be used over and over causing the game to be stagnant, causing players who want to play their own builds to lose interest. I found this campaign was way more difficult towards the end than the others were. The only thing I wish was different is that the campaign was longer.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sha Noran

2. Why are the rewards you can receive from the endgame Droknar's Key collectors so... bad?
Forget the stats, who cares what the stats are. Someone will like the stats. Let's instead look at the skins... every single one of the things you offer there are old skins dyed pale blue to look like stone. As Souske likes to ask: Are you kidding me? Even the Forgotten at the end of Nightfall had some cool skins (i.e. the Forgotten Blade). I mean, I might have thought the Dwarven Axe was cool if it wasn't, you know, available as an inscribable skin from a collector in the Central Transfer Chamber.

Why wouldn't they use the old skins? This takes place in Tyria, thus why the skins are mostly Tyrian. If you notice, the green rewards at the end of factions are mostly non-unique skins also. I don't hear you bitching about that. BTW all these skins are unique themselves because of the color. At least this time the caster item stats don't suck (yay cheap 40/40 sets).

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sha Noran

3. Why do only some of the final dungeon bosses posses devastatingly overpowered monster skills?
The final boss of the Sepulchre of Dragrimmar, the Remnant of Antiquities, boasts the devastating skill Diamondshard Mist. Despite the relatively short actual dungeon, it is a satisfying challenge due to his impressive firepower, specifically his monster skill. This gave me hope that each dungeon would have such a challenge at the end, much in the way that Urgoz and Kanaxai can easily decimate an entire party even if the whole rest of the dungeon had not been much of a challenge. Sadly, I discovered that this was not the case. Many of the final bosses of dungeons are really no more capable of killing you than their underlings, i.e. Havok Soulwail, the final boss of the Darkrime Delves. Why is this?

Maybe your party was more equipped to handle the warrior boss than it was to handle the ele boss? I'm guessing your team had more anti-melee than anti caster.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sha Noran

4. Why is it completely impossible to fail a dungeon?
Your party wipes, you rez. Your party wipes at 60% DP, you rez. Your ally, who is required for your quest, dies... he rezes. I had though during the preview weekend that these were just ways of allowing everyone to get a good feel for how dungeons would work, however I was wrong, all of these things are still true. Why? Why are there rez shrines in dungeons when there is nothing of the kind in any previous game's high end area? Why do NPCs just stand back up when killed, after nearly two years of part of the challenge being keeping them alive?

Rather than having you fail, maybe it was decided that they would actually reward the players that decided to stick it out. Having a ton of DP is going to make the dungeon a hell of a lot harder and its going to take way longer. I don't see how rewarding the players that are willing to stick it out is such a bad thing.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sha Noran

5. Why, in the hardcore expansion boasting specifically high end content, is there only one elite dungeon out of eighteen, and why is it not any harder than the other dungeons?
I called and got one of my friends out of bed to hop on and give it a try with me, and an hour and half and later we had beaten three out of the four bosses leading up to Duncan and had stopped caring, as people had reported that they had already completed the whole thing, and that there was nothing interesting out of the chest. Is this called an elite dungeon just because it's a bit longer than the others? And why is the quest marked not just Master's Level but Elite. It's not.

How can something be elite if there is a lot of them? Put simply it can't. Sure they could have more elite dungeons, but they chose not to. Maybe they will add more in the future. Also, there is more than one way to make a dungeon more difficult, and increasing the difficulty of the monsters isn't the only way to do it. I've been told by people who have done this entire quest that it takes a very long time to complete, way longer than any of the other dungeons. It rewards you for spending this time by giving you more drops than you would receive from another dungeon. Also, it isn't out of the realm of possibility for them to re-evaluate the difficulty of the dungeons after they have had player feedback, then make necessary changes.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sha Noran

6. Why are Destroyer weapons so woefully easy to acquire?
Tormented weapons require either a huge amount of game play or a large amount of cash to purchase, and they were even more expensive before the price deflated to its current level. Why do Destroyer weapons cost a fraction of what Tormented weapons (or FoW armor for that matter...) do/did, when they are apparently the elite skin of GW:EN?

Maybe ANet felt they are an alternative to doing DoA. Maybe they felt there needed to be a more mid-level elite area, for people who find DoA too difficult. The only reason I think this is because the skins of the Destroyer weapons are inferior to the skins of the Tormented weapons. Destroyer items will basically be the poor man's tormented item.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sha Noran

7. Why are all the GW:EN armor sets just old armor sets with portions of the graphics changed?
Of all the things that I was sure of, I was most sure that there would be some cool new armor that would keep people both interested and grinding for a while to come. How could you possibly release a nearly 100% PvE expansion without a healthy dose of new armor skins? Sure you added in some cool individual things, i.e. Chaos Gloves, Blindfolds, etc., but those hardly sate that appetite that most PvE players have for armor. Having interesting armor is basically one of the primary objectives of your average GW PvE player, and I was pretty sure you knew that. Hell, the new hero armor is pretty awesome... why do they get cool new armor skins while we get old, reskinned garbage?

The armor overall is pretty terrible. I have nothing to add here. They made a definite mistake.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sha Noran

8. Why is Hard Mode not yet in the game?

You advertised Guild Wars: Eye of the North as the place that was supposed to be hard, yet the defining characteristic of all PvE since the release of Hard Mode has been how hard a place is in HM, not normal mode. I won't say that no one cares about normal mode, but for an area that is supposed to be designed for skilled players looking for a challenge, how can you not have HM in the game?

I'm sure they are figuring out how to properly re balance the areas. I have no doubt they will eventually release Hard Mode for EotN. Look how long it took for Hard Mode to be released for the rest of the game. Be patient and give them some time.

I'll leave you with a final thought: you can make this game as difficult as you want it. You can make this game as enjoyable as you want it. Be creative.

Jesus that was a lot of typing.

Antheus · Sep 11, 2007, 02:44 AM // 02:44

Quote:

What you really want is a high/uncapped leveling system, you just don't realize it yet. Of course no-one thinks they do because when they think of leveling they think of grinding, as leveling has always been a tool for the pay-to-play business model. It serves other roles too, though. Mostly as a time-consuming crutch for the unskilled, and conversely, a continuing challenge for the skilled.

Level based games have no challenge whatsoever. They serve only grinders.

Even more, level based games are downright hostile towards skilled players. No matter how good you are, your level determines what you can do.

To put it otherway. The worst level 70 player in WoW will beat the best pvper at level 60 every single time. No skill involved.

GW's model has proven inadequacies elsewhere - the ability to produce content. With a completely new continent every 6 months, a complete armor/weapon/monster set, there was no way they could keep up.

Level system gets around that.

But there is no skill involved. In level systems, person with no life wins every time.

Quote:

As Malice Black said, GW is not a good choice for the hardcore PvE player.

But are hardcore really where the future is? Or is that just a throwback to the tried and true grind-based model?

GW attracted a large number of people who did not want hard-core, yet enjoyed challenge. Prophecies PvE that lasted one year, despite its simplicity, managed to keep the playerbase.

In the time where all games are turning away from grind, trying to find ways to make games more appealing to casual play, GW is going the other way. Slowly, but surely.

Bankai · Sep 11, 2007, 05:58 AM // 05:58

Looking at the replies, I have only one thing to say.

The problems in the OP are the only problems in EotN.

With Hard Mode, you'll want to vanquish stuff. If you vanquish stuff, you get a lot of title track points. So, there's no need to grind at all. Plus, you'll get much higher drops.

mr_groovy · Sep 11, 2007, 06:22 AM // 06:22

I don't personally own Gwen, but seeing the point mentioned here and how guildies experience gwen, I think the Op has made some valid points. This together with no news on alternative payment for the onlineshop makes me pretty sad. I think Anet has been to quiet on these boards lately.

SharonC · Sep 11, 2007, 06:39 AM // 06:39

I've only been playing GW for about 10 months, so I am not an elite player. I have two characters that have managed to complete all three primary campaigns, one that is almost through the third campaign, and along the way I have learned a lot about various skills and how they mesh together.

For me, Eye of the North is fun. A lot of fun. I like the fact that I can complete the whole thing with heroes and hench if I plan well. I like the fact that I can try other builds than fire on an elementalist. I love most of the dungeons (except Frontis's. I hate playing without backup.)

Some of the points made in the initial post I agree with completely, others I do not. From what I have already said, I don't agree that it is too easy. Easier than I had really expected, but that puts it in reach of the people who have only been playing for a few months and haven't really spent the time to learn all the skills as well as I have, or as the elite players have.

For the more casual player, Eye of the North is just enough of a challenge to keep them interested. For the others, I think you will have to wait till Hard Mode is enabled.

I also agree about the end game greens. I was quite disappointed with the stats. About the only greens I plan to get are ones that have stats matching collectors ones I was planning on getting eventually as backup weapons.

About some of the others, I have only completed about 4 dungeons so far. (I keep getting distracted into helping others do them again

) and so can't really tell if they are also too easy. I also don't mind that a party getting wiped means a rez at the rez shrine, because in some dungeons, getting to the final level takes a long time and having to start over would probably keep some people from coming back to try it again.

Frankly, about the only thing I dislike about EotN is something not mentioned in the post at all. Solo quests. If they give a reward that I want like a skill, I will do them. Eventually. I LIKE having backup.

I also do not like things like the Norn Tourney (which I only did enough to get my heroes and Zho's journal), or Polymock, or Dwarven boxing. Frankly, I find the solo mini games annoying. I will do them solely long enough to get any needed skills/heroes/items then I plan to forget they exist. I really wish that I didn't have to do any of them at all. I would prefer that the skills, especially, also be available in some other fashion.

Well, this turned out to be a longer post than planned. On the whole, I like this expansion. I will also try to do some of the things in hard mode once it is finally enabled. But for now, you might catch me out hunting dungeons. Or helping others with quests. Or farming for destroyer cores because I have decided my one ele really really has to have a pair of those gloves

.

Woodsy.

Estic · Sep 11, 2007, 06:47 AM // 06:47

Quote:

Originally Posted by Malice Black

GW isn't for hardcore PvE players, if you are really that unhappy, find another game.

QFT.

Really, that's all there is to say about it. GW is aimed at the more casual gamer. If you want to be able to fail, retry and get better, you need a different game.

Note: This is in no way a bad thing in my opinion. It's a decision by the developers and I am happy with it. I'm not happy about the armor reskins though.

bamm bamm bamm · Sep 11, 2007, 07:38 AM // 07:38

Quote:

Originally Posted by Antheus

Level based games have no challenge whatsoever. They serve only grinders.

No, they don't have to at all.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Antheus

Even more, level based games are downright hostile towards skilled players. No matter how good you are, your level determines what you can do.

To put it otherway. The worst level 70 player in WoW will beat the best pvper at level 60 every single time. No skill involved.

Your level is not the only thing that determines what you can do. Your level multiplied by your skill determines what you can do. The skillful among us have no need to grind for higher levels. A level 70 beating a level 60? I specifically said 'PvE'.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Antheus

GW's model has proven inadequacies elsewhere - the ability to produce content. With a completely new continent every 6 months, a complete armor/weapon/monster set, there was no way they could keep up.

I agree.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Antheus

Level system gets around that.

Only if it is used in that way. I could have sworn I already said all this.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Antheus

But there is no skill involved. In level systems, person with no life wins every time.

I guess that's why I consider a competitive and fair PvP environment an absolute necessity and I only mentioned PvE. I guess that's why they're doing that in GW2. Yep, that would be it.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Antheus

But are hardcore really where the future is? Or is that just a throwback to the tried and true grind-based model?

No, the future isn't with the hardcore PvE player, where did I say that? I simply said GW wasn't for him, no more, no less. You appear to hold the belief that a leveling system is designed for the hardcore gamer. In the past this may have been true as they have always been so steep and demanded a time investment. What if the skilled player took on the harder enemies and was rewarded for his skill with enough XP to keep himself ahead of the curve? How is that a content throttle? How is that grind? That's challenging. As I said, when people think of leveling they think of grinding, as you have done.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Antheus

GW attracted a large number of people who did not want hard-core, yet enjoyed challenge.

And if it had a PvE leveling system it would be better equipped to cater to the whole spectrum of players.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Antheus

In the time where all games are turning away from grind, trying to find ways to make games more appealing to casual play, GW is going the other way. Slowly, but surely.

I notice you're still using the word 'grind', something that I've explained doesn't have to be the case for the skilled player, but is important for the unskilled player in order to improve. Mandatory grinding levels is a precedent set by MMORPGs of past that doesn't have to be. It's all in the implementation. You need to use your imagination.

Muspellsheimr · Sep 11, 2007, 08:26 AM // 08:26

Well thought-out and written.

I fully agree with most points.

About giving the destroyers healers/protectors however, I have to disagree partially - from the lore, their only purpose is to destroy. Everything. So having members of their species who focus on healing & restoration does not make sense. I would, however, like to see an innate damage reduction / health regeneration for them, to make up for their lack of monks & similar.

On the account of Hard Mode, I am disappointed about it not being in the game yet, but it is supposedly currently being worked on, and will hopefully be released soon.